The best summary of the Saddleback Civil Forum comes from a comment left at Hugh Hewitt’s blog:
| dantana writes: | Saturday, August, 16, 2008 11:35 PM |
| McCain by a TKO | |
| No surprise.
Obama is a post modern college prof who is the product of the antiseptic ivory tower. McCain is a 70 year dude who has spent a lifetime getting his butt out of tough situations and grappling with reality. No contest. |
|
I’m not clear where I ACTUALLY said that Barack Obama had committed adultery. I think someone is READING INTO my comments.
Oh, and Pixel… If you take off the pirate suit and limit the indiscriminate ARRUGHS…you might be able to play the midshipman’s part a little more convincingly.
Nancy, a comedy mixed with fantasy, just shy of horror. But I guess with my PG-13 comments on another post, we’d never get it past Dobson’s censors! 🙂
God and Culture Blog…the movie….a comedy of course… The writers will have an easy job of this one… the dialog can pretty much be lifted as originally played….ROFL
For all of you out there who want a chance to read what was ACTUALLY said instead of the left or right political analysis and spin, here’s a link to the transcript:
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0808/17/se.01.html
Read it for yourself, and don’t be afraid of the truth.
Paul, you DID call Pixelmaster a liar – he has stated NUMEROUS times on your blog what his position is, and yet you still label him a left winger. Your very actions say that you don’t believe what he said – that’s calling him a liar. And you call him a poser, which is also a form of lying. If that’s your standard of “truth”, you can have it, but it’s not for me. It’s like saying “It’s not torture, it’s aggressive interrogation techniques.” THAT is not a Christian response.
And FYI, I am not one of the “you people” that is pillorying McCain about his past. And I don’t have an “unwavering commitment to ambiguity” – I am unwavering about you speaking the TRUTH and not these distorted, slanted, trumped up attacks. I don’t give a (insert object of your choice) whether you’re for Obama or McCain so much as that you portray them with fairness and accuracy, neither of which you are doing. You’re free to control your blog and even to delete my comments, but the truth will still be “out there”, and contrary to your accusation, I DO believe it is knowable.
Paul,
You mentioned previously:
“1. John McCain has admitted his adultery; Barack Obama has not. Does being a sinner disqualify a person from being president? Would you rather have a president who confesses his sins or one who pretends to be above sin? Shall we list the sins of the candidates side by side and whoever has the least wins? Could you get the log out of your own eye before you go pulling the speck out of McCain’s?”
Where is the info on Obama’s adultery that you seem to be accusing him of?
Pixelmaster,
You never heard me mention John Edwards’ family life on my show either, until he confessed and then we talked about it in the context of Christian forgiveness. McCain’s moral failure is admitted and confessed. Why don’t you forgive him and move on instead of using left wing talking points to beat him up?
b/Bo,
I didn’t call Pixelamster a liar. I said that he is a left winger posing as a moderate. “[T]he breadth of Pix’s numerous comments” here prove that.
Both of you need to recognize that you are allowed to freely comment on this blog so long as you understand that the moderator of this blog is unapologetically conservative, and still believes there is a universal standard for truth. The tension in the recent posts originate in my unwavering commitment to that universal standard and your unwavering commitment to ambiquity (which you view as truth).
I will control the content on this blog. I will identify pretenders as such based on a universal standard of truth and not some wishy-washy, willy-nilly abstraction passing itself off as truth. Dissenting opinion is welcomed, but it will always be challenged.
Here is the truth: Obama is a liar and a deceiver an an antichrist, using God’s word illegimately to win an election. McCain is a fallen sinner who has confessed publicly his sin, which confession you people are using to pillory him, which doesn’t seem like a very Christian response to me.
Paul, now you’re calling Pix a liar. He may be vociferous, but I don’t think he’s disingenuous. It’s common to try to dismiss someone by labeling them (insert Kierkegaard quote here), but anyone who has read the breadth of Pix’s numerous comments knows that such a label is off the mark.
Paul,
HAHA
If I could only show you the Ron Paul sign that is still in my front window even though he is not even running.
I also am not sure what left wing talking points you are talking about, I questioned a comment about Obama and something about an affair that you insinuated, I also mentioned the fact that McCain left his first wife after she was “damaged” but a bad accident. Look it up.
I also mentioned my opinion of how social conservatives have essentially flip flopped on McCain. The very reason why many couldn’t stand him in April has turned into a strength. The only info I rec’d from the left on this is the McCain issue, which is the reason why one needs to listen to both sides when looking at candidates. I have never heard on your show any mention of McCain’s family life because when the light of truth is shown on it, it is very ugly.
Some “bloopers” from the debate:
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/saddleback_bloopers.html
Pixelmaster,
These kinds of comments are what affirms that you are indeed a LEFT WINGER posing as a moderate. You consistently hit all the left wing talking points.
BTW, conspiracy theories are all false, no one ever “attributes the ultimate cause of an event or chain of events (usually political, social or historical events), or the concealment of such causes from public knowledge, to a secret and often deceptive plot by a group of powerful or influential people or organizations” *via the left wing Wikipedia
No that never happens, no major even in history has ever had a conspiracy behind it, even the official conspiracy theory is not a conspiracy. No, 19 hijackers took over 4 planes and conspired to take down major elements of our business and government on 9/11, that didn’t happen because the explanation is a “conspiracy theory”.
“1. John McCain has admitted his adultery; Barack Obama has not. Does being a sinner disqualify a person from being president? Would you rather have a president who confesses his sins or one who pretends to be above sin? Shall we list the sins of the candidates side by side and whoever has the least wins? Could you get the log out of your own eye before you go pulling the speck out of McCain’s?”
RE Obama affair, huh, is this another right wing rumor that I am not aware of? Also, not only did McCain have an adulturous affair, he left his wife after she had an serious accident and “didn’t look the same” Pretty low, not good family values
“3. McCain IS the change we can believe in because, unlike Obama, he is bold enough to go against the grain of his own party. Name me ONE TIME Obama has gone against his own party on any issue? Obama lied to Rick Warren when he said that he worked with McCain on Campaign Finance Reform”
This is so funny to watch the “change” that takes place in the social conservative movement. The very things they hated about him are now the things that make him Bold and Strong. I love this stuff, very funny.
Rick,
1. John McCain has admitted his adultery; Barack Obama has not. Does being a sinner disqualify a person from being president? Would you rather have a president who confesses his sins or one who pretends to be above sin? Shall we list the sins of the candidates side by side and whoever has the least wins? Could you get the log out of your own eye before you go pulling the speck out of McCain’s?
2. When exactly did McCain lie to the audience at Saddleback about being in a “cone of silence”? Obama did so poorly at Saddleback it became necessary for him to invent a scenario in which McCain had an advantage. Rick Warren is on record ( Larry King Live, August 18 ) as affirming that there is no way McCain heard any part of the questions to Obama. Obama supporters have to hold on to conspiracy theories to solidify their faith in a candidate who cannot be trusted.
3. McCain IS the change we can believe in because, unlike Obama, he is bold enough to go against the grain of his own party. Name me ONE TIME Obama has gone against his own party on any issue? Obama lied to Rick Warren when he said that he worked with McCain on Campaign Finance Reform. Byron York at National Review has the REAL story:
. . . . . . . .
“Well, I’ll give you an example that in fact I worked with John McCain on,” Obama said, “and that was the issue of campaign ethics reform and finance reform.” But it turned out that was an issue on which Obama had briefly allied with McCain and then jumped back to the Democratic mother ship, causing McCain to write Obama an angry note about the abandonment of what had been a principled position. As far as bucking your party goes, it wasn’t very big stuff.
. . . . . . . .
Debate the following:
1. John McCain is an adulterer, Barack Obama is not.
Good point, social conservatives are all jumping on the McCain bandwagon when a look into their own personal lives reveal that Obama is the one with family values.
2. McCain lied to the Saddleback audience that he was in a cone of silence when he was in traffic, and likely listening to the questions posed to Obama.
I admit I am not up on this story, all I do know is that if McCain was sharp on his answers..Then who knows, future debates will have to hash this out.
3. McCain has betrayed core Conservative values his entire career.
Another good point and one that I brought up earlier I honestly wonder since McCain is a 1 termer if he won’t be the worst president for social conservatives. There is no love lost for GWB backers from McCain’s point of view.
Debate the following:
1. John McCain is an adulterer, Barack Obama is not.
2. McCain lied to the Saddleback audience that he was in a cone of silence when he was in traffic, and likely listening to the questions posed to Obama.
3. McCain has betrayed core Conservative values his entire career.
Nancy, does that mean your last name is Littella? Distant relation perhaps?
Oh,,,never mind…
I need to check and see if Joe Walsh is running again this year… this time around he just might get my vote…
He says he’s a JESUSist – it just LOOKS like Jesuit. But if we’re not saints, then we’re not His, right?
Bo…
I had an impression once that Don was a Jesuit….but now he’s been sainted??? Did I read that right or is it my eyes….
he he
Well, Paul, I’m still looking forward to seeing it for myself (and voting for neither of them). 🙂
St. Don, I didn’t think you were that old… at least, you’re not any older than me than you used to be… 😉
“McCain of now is NOTHING like the McCain of the past?”
Just trying to keep Jesus in the forefront.
~~ (do I have to make sense, all the time? that gets difficult for a fella my age)
Yes, Bob, Obama did come off “quite conversational and thoughful” if you consider “Um…Ah…Well…Ah” conversational and thoughtful. McCain’s answers were direct. Obama seemed like a deer caught in the headlights most of the night, obfiscated on the question of when life begins (“above my pay-grade”), and pandered to his liberal base by throwing Clarence Thomas under the bus, asserting Thomas did not have enough experience to be a Supreme Court Justice – as if his own 138 working days in the Senate far exceeds the 3,650 plus days of experience Thomas had at the time of his nomination.
We don’t need to paint a caricature of Obama here. He has done a fine job of that on his own – and lives up to it quite well.
Unfortunately I missed most of the live airing, but I’ll have to make time to see it on YouTube. Then I can see for myself if this is just more caricaturing of Obama (as I suspect) and grasping for straws with McCain. My closest ‘advisors’ (yes, I actually have some) said that Obama came off quite conversational and thoughtful while McCain came of more as a politician with all the “my friends” and pandering to the audience. It’ll be quite fascinating seeing it for myself…
Don, what the heck was that in reference to? I looked in both of Pix’s postings but couldn’t draw the connection – unless it was “what I want is someone who is smart”, but I really didn’t think that was the case.
Pix
Neither am I.
And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
Paul,
For one, I will not buy into the way you frame that question. What I want is someone who is smart, I also, unlike our current genius in the office, want someone who will surround himself with varied and bright people to give him the information he needs to properly run this country. McCain has shown himself unsuccessful in many attempts in this arena, Hagee, Parsley, recent financial advisor, his foreign policy advisors are obviously not doing well since he confuses Sunni and shia all the time. I want a man in office that is smart enough to filter the garbage and humble enough to listen to all the arguments. I don’t see it in McCain. Does Obama meet this qualification, I have many questions, I do think he is better than McCain though, in this specific area.
So what you’re saying, Pixelmaster, is that you’d rather have LESS experience as opposed to MORE in your president?
All you folks who are “getting on” the McCain bus, doesn’t it concern you that the McCain of now is NOTHING like the McCain of the past? You all talk about the lack of experiance of Obama, but wouldn’t McCain’s depth of experiance concern social conservatives?
Paul
You have been a busy lad this morning!
I’ve not been a strong supporter of McCain, but I saw and heard enough last evening to get on board.
BTW, as you know, “kissing up” is not a strong suit of mine, but as I read your responses, my admiration grows for you also.