Two important essays today encouraging the faithful to “prepare your minds for action” (1 Peter 1:13) in anticipation of the coming persecution of U. S. Christians:
Dr. Albert Mohler urges us to “take a careful look” at how homosexual activists are responding to the passage of Proposition 8 in California: “[T]he coercive effect is to punish anyone who will not recognize, endorse, or celebrate same-sex marriages.”
Dr. Richard John Neuhaus warns that “we are heading into a greatly intensified public clash of state power and religious freedom,” for which Christians are ill-prepared. His concluding graph is ominous:
Yes, the imminent Kulturkampf, if that is what is in the offing, will require legal talent, political strategizing, relentless persuasion, and all the other means compatible with our constitutional order. Most of all, however, it requires the courage born of faith that the Church really is the Body of Christ through time, a distinct and public community bearing public witness to public truths about the right ordering of life both public and personal. In Catholic history, the cry through the centuries is for libertas ecclesiae—the freedom of the Church to be the Church. For Catholics and others, that freedom now faces a time of severe testing. In the defense of that freedom there have been through the centuries martyrs beyond numbering. We do not know what will happen in the months and years ahead, except that now it may be our turn.
Tim,
much of my sentiments were reflected in Chris’ post. I don’t think the church should be silenced, I just have an issue with how much it focuses on the issue of homosexuality over the other sin’s in it’s own walls (it always seems to go back to politics and wedge issues). This method has all ways been the case, it is always issues outside the church that are the problems with society not issues within.
I haven’t read all the response Tim but I wanted to mention, I brought up homosexuality because that is ALWAYS the case that is brought up of preachers getting “persecuted” for preaching on “the gospel” or “Christ”. I will read that rest and as most know about me, I will respond.
Chris,
I wasn’t talking about legislating anything against anyone. I was talking about someone else legislating away our freedom to preach the whole Scripture, regardless of whether or not they agree with parts of it. Society may allow all manner of activities contrary to Scripture – it has happened before and it will hapen again. But if it becomes illegal to quote Scripture because it causes some discomfort, how then shall we preach? We will be forced to disobey a man-made law that opposes our God-made instructions. The result is predictable.
Regarding the church removing the plank from its own eye, that should be an ongoing and lifelong practice in our relationship with God. But it should not prevent or interfere with the preaching of the Word of God.
Here’s where I get confused.
As a Christian, I believe Homosexuality is a sin. The Bible teaches it. And to say that our culture just needs to grow up and get with the program belittles the honest struggle of many true Believers who struggle with homosexual desires and have to lean on the Grace and Strength of God to practice self-control and abstinence, knowing that they may never experience an intimate human relationship. To just “get with it” is just as unappreciative of the struggle with sin and dependence on God as programs designed to “cure” homosexuality are.
But I also firmly believe that homosexuality is simply a sin. Not THE sin. No one is going to hell because they’re gay. People are going to hell because they are sinners. Homosexuality is just one symptom of the deeper sin disease. So I feel if we’re going to legislate sin, then we would have to put laws in place that outlaw adultery, regulate divorce, prohibit any drunkenness or cursing, limit greed and excessive wealth, etc. And that has yet to happen.
Also, I worry that many use homosexuality as a distraction to focus the issue away from sins prevelant in the church, like adultery, pornography, child abuse and other sins that contribute to the 50% divorce rate. It’s not that we shouldn’t be honest and call sin as it is, but I worry that we spend too much time pointing out the specks in our neighbors’ eyes without beginning to deal with the planks in our own.
Jeff,
“I agree that speech should be free so long as no harm is do(ne) to any other group of people.” Very generous of you. Is it harmful to shine light on sin, thereby showing us all our need for a Saviour? The law is our schoolmaster, showing us where we have missed the mark. Christ is our redeemer, saving us from the condemnation resulting from our sins, through faith in Him.
How is this not preaching Christ? Who said anything about homosexuality? Or adultery? Or murder? Or any of the ways that mankind sins? It really doesn’t matter which particular flavor of poison a man may choose to drink. You’re still dead without Christ.
The defense of Scriptural text pertaining to homosexuality (since you brought it up) only becomes necessary when somebody wants to excise a passage from Scripture, or claims that the Bible doesn’t say something, when it clearly does. Unfortunately, this is a common tactic for those who do not wish to be reproved by Scripture. In a human sense, I can’t blame them. The easiest way to continue to “break the law” is to decriminalize the offense. This is what people are trying to do. If they succeed in decriminalizing the offense, what do they need to be saved from? Nothing. We recognize our need for Christ when we become aware of our sin. Deluding ourselves into the belief that somehow sin is not sin does not bring us closer to Christ. You see, it’s all related to preaching Christ. Sermons that warn against the sin of homosexuality are only necessary when people decide to challenge the very idea that it is sin. People today also challenge the idea that murder is not a sin (abortion, assisted suicide) and adultery / fornication (self evident). Any attempt to decriminalize or re-define sin is contrary to the idea of the need for Christ as the only Hope for us to escape the judgement of God. An attempt to call “evil” as though it were “good” and “good” as though it were “evil” is delusional and must be non-violently resisted for the sake of truth (remember, “For God so loved the world…). This seems pretty basic to me.
According to Scripture, from God’s perspective, ALL sin is “nasty” enough to condemn each and every one of us. To call something “righteous” that God calls “sin” is rejecting His definition – a dangerous thing to do.
“The attempt to silence the message of Christ is precisely where the persecution of the early church began.”
BTW, regarding that comment, from my understanding, the persecution of the church has a lot more to do with rejecting the divinity of the ruler of Roman and replacing him with Christ than it had to do with the message of Christ. I do not see any rulers claiming themselves to be God nowadays. Frankly, I don’t see that happening anytime soon. Please do not quote me Revelations as I understand that more as the way they wrote about issues of the day than about future events, apocryphal writing is what I think they call it.
Here is my question to you all, if a preacher speaks a message about how our society will be under the judgement of God if gay marriage is accepted and a person in his congregation harms a gay person should that pastor be held accountable? Is it hate speech or free speech?
OK, here we go.
“The attempt to silence the message of Christ is precisely where the persecution of the early church began.”
I hear this all the time as if preaching a sermon on how nasty homosexuality is “preaching Christ”. I agree that speech should be free so long as no harm is down to any other group of people. Unfortunately this is not the case, why is the church so focused on other groups and speaking against them when here is quite enough to preach about in it’s own walls? Until the church gets it’s own house in order it will have no ability to affect change in society. Preachers like to say it is abortion, or homosexuality that is wrong with society. I argue it is the church that is not reaching out to society to make effective change that is wrong with society. Society with shift back and forth, the question is, will we guard God’s message in our 4 walls are take it out to the world? When the church would rather build a coffee house over a soup kitchen there are serious issues. It’s why government needs to be that agent to help the needy, the church doesn’t want to get it’s hands dirty with that.
Chris,
Your very statement, “While I do worry about the eventuality of Free Speech being threatened in regard to preaching about the reality of sin, I think the fact that we would consider it persecution just shows how sheltered and protected the Church has been throughout American history.” contains within it the very reason why people are concerned about persecution. The attempt to silence the message of Christ is precisely where the persecution of the early church began.
Acts 4:18-20 says, “Then they called them in again and commanded them not to speak or teach at all in the name of Jesus. But Peter and John replied, “Judge for yourselves whether it is right in God’s sight to obey you rather than God. For we cannot help speaking about what we have seen and heard.”
This is where persecution begins, “You shall not speak…”. We “sheltered and protected” Christians are only reading the writing on the wall. I believe we have a historical and Scriptural leg to stand on – as well as other historical confirmations too numerous to mention.
In Canada, a Christian minister may teach and preach about anything in Scripture – except those things which the lawmakers deemed as unacceptable and discriminatory. The persecution comes to those ministers when they choose to obey God rather than men. They are sued, fined, threatened with imprisonment, and/or shut down for preaching and teaching Scripture. Unfortunately, many have allowed the State to dictate Holy Writ. For those, I suspect there is no persecution. They are good little Christians, seen and not heard, rendered impotent.
This Canadian model is what many want to see here in the United States. I’d say that is legitimate cause for alarm. The threat to free speech is without a doubt “entry level” persecution and must be resisted with all our strength.
Unfortunately, I am afraid that the term “persecution” is going to define itself for us before our very eyes.
Various forms of punishment to people who hold fast to Christ’s words and Scriptural teaching can all be forms of persecution. What you are arguing are the varying degrees of persecution. This argument will become meaningless as the intensity is ratcheted up. I anticipate the “Christian comfort zone” you may now enjoy will be seriously challenged very soon. Define it however you want for the time being, it’s just samantics.
The amount of persecution a Christian may be subjected to is indirectly proportional to how greatly they capitulate to the powers of this world. The more a person dilutes his Christianity, the less persection he may expect to encounter. This is not new. It’s called “Following the Lord – 101”.
Colin,
I think curley might be referring to something like this:
htt p://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arlington_Group
The group of folks behind the scenes in the christian right are very influential and very powerful in washington. It might be worthwhile to look up the Council for National Policy as well. Persecution to them is not having the ear of the president whenever they want.
Curley,
You really believe in light of our nations laws, what is taught in school, what is shown on television, and the rest of American culture that Christians run the show? Where did you get that from? Sure 40% or so claim to born again, but those 40% also believe extremely unChristian things. I would consider the beginning of persecution to be laws similar to those in Canada and Britain which fine or even jail pastors for speaking out against homosexuality, such as by saying that kindergarteners shouldn’t have “why Heather has two mommies” read to them.
Puh-leez! If Christians suffer any ‘persecution’ in this country, ever, I’ll eat my hat! You people run the show. The vast majority of Americans are freakin’ Christians! And it’s interesting that you leave persecution undefined. What exactly would you consider persecution? Being forced to sell Plan B to a woman who wants to buy it simply because your job is to sell drugs to people who want to buy them? Being forbidden to discriminate in business dealings based on sexual orientation? Is that persecution? Really?
While I do worry about the eventuality of Free Speech being threatened in regard to preaching about the reality of sin, I think the fact that we would consider it persecution just shows how sheltered and protected the Church has been throughout American history.
The Church has been so snug and so comfortable being in bed with politicians and political parties that it has found its place as its own subculture, raising its voice a little bit when someone swears on TV but really enjoying a position of power and influence that really is antithetical to what Christ taught. The fact that we have not faced any persecution is both a showing of God’s blessing but also, I believe, an indictment that the American Church has comfortably made itself a part of the world, instead of being a counterculture force that calls out sin–and by that I mean not just homosexuality and abortion, but the rampant greed that fuels capatilism, the “what’s in it for me” mentality that America has toward needy third-world nations and the belief that a good, successful life is one that is rewarded with a nice house, 3.5 kids and a picket fence. Perhaps we’re due some persecution because then it might show that we actually believe something different than the world.
But let’s be clear–any threat to free speech is minor persecution compared to what Believers face around the world. I have a feeling that Believers who are jailed, beaten and killed for their faith would be very happy simply only to have their speech blocked. I’m not saying that it’s right to restrict speech–I’m simply saying that we’ve got it pretty good. And even if it goes “bad,” we’ll still have it pretty good. And persecution might be the thing the Church needs right now.